Xojo Conferences
MBSOct2019CologneDE

MacAliasRecord's Update problem... (Real Studio network user group Mailinglist archive)

Back to the thread list
Previous thread: Out of Bounds Exception Bug
Next thread: Scrolling a Portion of a Canvas


Re: recordset's recordcount   -   Jan Erik Moström <
  MacAliasRecord's Update problem...   -   Jean
   Re: MacAliasRecord's Update problem...   -   Christian Schmitz
    Re: MacAliasRecord's Update problem...   -   Boris Segerstahl
     Re: MacAliasRecord's Update problem...   -   Frank Bitterlich
      Re: MacAliasRecord's Update problem...   -   Charles Yeomans
       Re: MacAliasRecord's Update problem...   -   Frank Bitterlich
        Re: MacAliasRecord's Update problem...   -   Will Leshner
         Re: MacAliasRecord's Update problem...   -   Kevin Ballard
          Re: MacAliasRecord's Update problem...   -   Will Leshner
           Re: MacAliasRecord's Update problem...   -   Charles Yeomans
        FFT   -   Scott Griebel
     Re: MacAliasRecord's Update problem...   -   Joseph J. Strout
     Re: MacAliasRecord's Update problem...   -   Christian Schmitz
    Re: MacAliasRecord's Update problem...   -   Thomas Reed

MacAliasRecord's Update problem...
Date: 28.08.02 01:50 (Tue, 27 Aug 2002 20:50:58 -0400)
From: Jean
Hi!

I have this project that relies on TT's Alias Mgr plugin to
store file aliases into resources... Now all of a sudden these crash
my application when I do alias.update... I am on Mac OS 10.1.5 (no
Jaguar yet - sigh!), using RB 4.0.2... The project was created with
RB 3.5 and ran without a glitch (in this area, anyways ;-) ) and now
that I run it in RB 4.0.2 it crashes almost everytime... Anyone else
experienced this? Any thoughts / ideas?

Thanks!

Re: MacAliasRecord's Update problem...
Date: 28.08.02 02:23 (Wed, 28 Aug 2002 03:23:49 +0200)
From: Christian Schmitz
> Hi!
>
> I have this project that relies on TT's Alias Mgr plugin to
> store file aliases into resources... Now all of a sudden these crash
> my application when I do alias.update... I am on Mac OS 10.1.5 (no
> Jaguar yet - sigh!), using RB 4.0.2... The project was created with
> RB 3.5 and ran without a glitch (in this area, anyways ;-) ) and now
> that I run it in RB 4.0.2 it crashes almost everytime... Anyone else
> experienced this? Any thoughts / ideas?

Please try the MBS Plugin and report if you still have this crashes.
If yes, I'll send you a debug version to find the exact line in the code
where it crashes.

Mfg
Christian

Re: MacAliasRecord's Update problem...
Date: 28.08.02 08:02 (Wed, 28 Aug 2002 10:02:18 +0300)
From: Boris Segerstahl
Correct me if I a wrong but somehow I had the impression that Alias Mgr
was free while MBS costs at least 40$. This is one of the foggy places
in RB's universe. The Gurus say: Never use absolute path. If you need it
use something like alias manager which is free. I quote a recent posting
"...TT's AliasRecord plugin (<http://www.tempel.org/rb/>) is a free way
to create an alias record, which you can store wherever you
like. Note that although he no longer supports this plugin, a free and
Carbonized version (that someone else Carbonized) is available...".

I think MBS is a great achievement and certainly worth its price for
those who really need it. The combination of capabilities makes it very
cheap in the end. But it is not fair to force RB users to pay Christian
because of a major problem with the usability of RB.

I wonder how RS in the future is going to handle its coexistence with
plugin developers who plug RB's leaking holes? Will RS let the problems
live, in order to avoid harming the plugin developers? Don't
misunderstand me. I think that the fact that there is a lot of very good
plugins around is of great benefit to everybody and I certainly hope
that this will be even more so in the future. But path, file, folder and
alias management should not force users to pay extra cash.

I hope I am wrong. What have I misunderstood?

Boris

>> Hi!
>>
>> I have this project that relies on TT's Alias Mgr plugin to
>> store file aliases into resources... Now all of a sudden these crash
>> my application when I do alias.update... I am on Mac OS 10.1.5 (no
>> Jaguar yet - sigh!), using RB 4.0.2... The project was created with
>> RB 3.5 and ran without a glitch (in this area, anyways ;-) ) and now
>> that I run it in RB 4.0.2 it crashes almost everytime... Anyone else
>> experienced this? Any thoughts / ideas?
>
> Please try the MBS Plugin and report if you still have this crashes.
> If yes, I'll send you a debug version to find the exact line in the code
> where it crashes.
>
> Mfg
> Christian
>
> --
> A thousand functions in one Realbasic plugin. The MBS Plugin.
> (currently 53 plugin parts, over 1919 functions)
>
> <http://www.monkeybreadsoftware.de/realbasic/plugins.html>
> ---
> Subscribe to the digest:
> <mailto:<email address removed>>
> Unsubscribe:
> <mailto:<email address removed>>
___________________________________
Boris Segerstahl
<email address removed>

---
Subscribe to the digest:
<mailto:<email address removed>>
Unsubscribe:
<mailto:<email address removed>>

Re: MacAliasRecord's Update problem...
Date: 28.08.02 12:45 (Wed, 28 Aug 2002 13:45:36 +0200)
From: Frank Bitterlich
Boris Segerstahl wrote:
> I think that the fact that there is a lot of very good
> plugins around is of great benefit to everybody and I certainly hope
> that this will be even more so in the future. But path, file, folder and
> alias management should not force users to pay extra cash.

I think you're absolutely right. Although I don't have Christians plugin
yet, I will probably purchase it soon; but I too feel that the very
basic things like alias management should be in RB itself. Especially
since about once a week you can read a post on this list where someone
is having problems because he uses an AbsolutePath. That should ring a
bell at REALsoftware, IMHO.

But just in case it doesn't, I will send a REALbugs request for it right
now. Boris, I suggest that both you and your dog submit one each, too -
and everybody else who has ever had a problem with storing a path to a
file or folder reliably.

Cheers,
Frank+++

Re: MacAliasRecord's Update problem...
Date: 28.08.02 15:52 (Wed, 28 Aug 2002 10:52:42 -0400)
From: Charles Yeomans

On Wednesday, August 28, 2002, at 07:45 AM, Frank Bitterlich wrote:

> Boris Segerstahl wrote:
>> I think that the fact that there is a lot of very good
>> plugins around is of great benefit to everybody and I certainly hope
>> that this will be even more so in the future. But path, file, folder
>> and
>> alias management should not force users to pay extra cash.
>
> I think you're absolutely right. Although I don't have Christians plugin
> yet, I will probably purchase it soon; but I too feel that the very
> basic things like alias management should be in RB itself. Especially
> since about once a week you can read a post on this list where someone
> is having problems because he uses an AbsolutePath. That should ring a
> bell at REALsoftware, IMHO.

I'd guess that the bell it rings is the "incompetent coder" bell. There
is nothing inherently wrong with storing a folder item path and using it
to recreate the folder item. The problem comes when people plug the
path into GetFolderItem and fail to realize that it might return nil, or
why it might do so. Then they post a message to the list along the
lines of "hey, my 100-line method is raising a NilObjectException.
What's the problem?" The RB documentation has many gaps, but none of
them occur in the GetFolderItem docs.

Charles Yeomans


---
Subscribe to the digest:
<mailto:<email address removed>>
Unsubscribe:
<mailto:<email address removed>>

Re: MacAliasRecord's Update problem...
Date: 28.08.02 16:19 (Wed, 28 Aug 2002 17:19:13 +0200)
From: Frank Bitterlich
Charles Yeomans wrote:
>
> On Wednesday, August 28, 2002, at 07:45 AM, Frank Bitterlich wrote:
>
> > Boris Segerstahl wrote:
> >> I think that the fact that there is a lot of very good
> >> plugins around is of great benefit to everybody and I certainly hope
> >> that this will be even more so in the future. But path, file, folder
> >> and
> >> alias management should not force users to pay extra cash.
> >
> > I think you're absolutely right. Although I don't have Christians plugin
> > yet, I will probably purchase it soon; but I too feel that the very
> > basic things like alias management should be in RB itself. Especially
> > since about once a week you can read a post on this list where someone
> > is having problems because he uses an AbsolutePath. That should ring a
> > bell at REALsoftware, IMHO.
>
> I'd guess that the bell it rings is the "incompetent coder" bell. There
> is nothing inherently wrong with storing a folder item path and using it
> to recreate the folder item. The problem comes when people plug the
> path into GetFolderItem and fail to realize that it might return nil, or
> why it might do so. Then they post a message to the list along the
> lines of "hey, my 100-line method is raising a NilObjectException.
> What's the problem?" The RB documentation has many gaps, but none of
> them occur in the GetFolderItem docs.

Well I don't agree 100% with this. When this problem occurs very
frequently (it appears to be in the top-5 frequently made mistakes),
something must be wrong here. Either we have a LOT of incompetent coders
on this list, or something is wrong with the docs. While it might say
that the use of .AbsolutePath is insufficient for some purposes, it
doesn't say what to use instead.

Sure, how could it? You can't very well write "use an alias instead of
the path", if RB doesn't support alias records.

And IMHO there _is_ something inherently wrong with the technique of
restoring FolderItems using an AbsolutePath (note: not with the
AbsolutePath property itself; it works as documented). The reason: It is
very unlikely that your app will run in an environment where you *know*
that it will deliver predictable results. Sure, you can find it out; see
if there are duplicate volume names present, check the length of the
path etc., but what to do if you find out that it will fail? Crash and
burn (well, not literally of course, but your app would fail to open the file.)

So I remain with the statement:
Restoring FolderItems by using a stored .AbsolutePath is a bad thing. Period.

But as you wrote, there's no gap in the docs in this respect; the gap is
in RB itself. Not the only one, most likely not the last one, and not a
fatal one. But a gap nonetheless. That's why we have REALbugs.

Anyway, if I interpret Joe's last message in this thread correctly, I
assume that we will have news on that topic sooner or later.

Cheers,
Frank+++

Re: MacAliasRecord's Update problem...
Date: 28.08.02 18:46 (Wed, 28 Aug 2002 10:46:16 -0700)
From: Will Leshner
Maybe the news will be that RS is adding alias support and removing the
AbsolutePath property from FolderItems.

On Wednesday, August 28, 2002, at 08:19 AM, Frank Bitterlich wrote:

> Anyway, if I interpret Joe's last message in this thread correctly, I
> assume that we will have news on that topic sooner or later.

---
Subscribe to the digest:
<mailto:<email address removed>>
Unsubscribe:
<mailto:<email address removed>>

Re: MacAliasRecord's Update problem...
Date: 28.08.02 18:58 (Wed, 28 Aug 2002 13:58:01 -0400)
From: Kevin Ballard
Why on earth would you remove the AbsolutePath property? That's used
for other things than setting the location of a folderitem.

On Wednesday, August 28, 2002, at 01:46 PM, Will Leshner wrote:

> Maybe the news will be that RS is adding alias support and removing
> the AbsolutePath property from FolderItems.

Re: MacAliasRecord's Update problem...
Date: 28.08.02 19:02 (Wed, 28 Aug 2002 11:02:00 -0700)
From: Will Leshner
I knew I should have had a smiley at the end. How *does* Charles get
away with that :)

On Wednesday, August 28, 2002, at 10:58 AM, Kevin Ballard wrote:

> Why on earth would you remove the AbsolutePath property? That's used
> for other things than setting the location of a folderitem.
>
> On Wednesday, August 28, 2002, at 01:46 PM, Will Leshner wrote:
>
>> Maybe the news will be that RS is adding alias support and removing
>> the AbsolutePath property from FolderItems.

---
Subscribe to the digest:
<mailto:<email address removed>>
Unsubscribe:
<mailto:<email address removed>>

Re: MacAliasRecord's Update problem...
Date: 28.08.02 19:21 (Wed, 28 Aug 2002 14:21:59 -0400)
From: Charles Yeomans
My ki is highly developed.

Charles Yeomans

On Wednesday, August 28, 2002, at 02:02 PM, Will Leshner wrote:

> I knew I should have had a smiley at the end. How *does* Charles get
> away with that :)
>
> On Wednesday, August 28, 2002, at 10:58 AM, Kevin Ballard wrote:
>
>> Why on earth would you remove the AbsolutePath property? That's used
>> for other things than setting the location of a folderitem.
>>
>> On Wednesday, August 28, 2002, at 01:46 PM, Will Leshner wrote:
>>
>>> Maybe the news will be that RS is adding alias support and removing
>>> the AbsolutePath property from FolderItems.
>


---
Subscribe to the digest:
<mailto:<email address removed>>
Unsubscribe:
<mailto:<email address removed>>

Re: MacAliasRecord's Update problem...
Date: 28.08.02 15:14 (Wed, 28 Aug 2002 07:14:03 -0700)
From: Joseph J. Strout
At 10:02 AM +0300 8/28/02, Boris Segerstahl wrote:

>Correct me if I a wrong but somehow I had the impression that Alias
>Mgr was free while MBS costs at least 40$. This is one of the foggy
>places in RB's universe. The Gurus say: Never use absolute path. If
>you need it use something like alias manager which is free.

Or subscribe to the DR list and see what appears in the next few weeks.

Cheers,
- Joe

Re: MacAliasRecord's Update problem...
Date: 28.08.02 16:34 (Wed, 28 Aug 2002 17:34:34 +0200)
From: Christian Schmitz
> Correct me if I a wrong but somehow I had the impression that Alias Mgr
> was free while MBS costs at least 40$.

Well, how much will be the RB 5.0 upgrade for you?

PS: I hope RS will make it's alias stuff well and avoid name conflicts
with alias plugins.

Mfg
Christian

Re: MacAliasRecord's Update problem...
Date: 28.08.02 19:18 (Wed, 28 Aug 2002 13:18:38 -0500)
From: Thomas Reed
> I have this project that relies on TT's Alias Mgr plugin to
>store file aliases into resources... Now all of a sudden these crash
>my application when I do alias.update...

This plugin is, sadly, quite outdated. I've recently discovered that
(at least in RB 4.5, possibly earlier) it has problems with files
whose names contain special characters -- such as accented
characters, bullets, trademark or copyright symbols, etc. It cannot
built an alias to such a file in my testing in 4.5.

I have heard, fortunately, that 5.0 will address this issue. I don't
know details.

In the meantime, your only option may be to purchase the MonkeyBread
software plugin. Or find someone to rewrite TT's plugin so it works
properly under OS X.