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Using HID devices with REALbasic (Real Studio network user group Mailinglist archive)

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Win32 API Declares   -   Berg, Heath
  Using HID devices with REALbasic   -   Dave Addey
   Re: Using HID devices with REALbasic   -   Joseph J. Strout
    Re: Using HID devices with REALbasic   -   Dave Addey
     Re: Using HID devices with REALbasic   -   Scott Wyatt
     Re: Using HID devices with REALbasic   -   Joseph J. Strout
      Re: Using HID devices with REALbasic   -   Dave Addey
       Re: Using HID devices with REALbasic   -   Dave Addey
        Re: Using HID devices with REALbasic   -   Dave Addey
        Re: Using HID devices with REALbasic   -   Charles Yeomans
         Re: Using HID devices with REALbasic   -   Dave Addey
          Re: Using HID devices with REALbasic   -   Charles Yeomans
          Re: Using HID devices with REALbasic   -   Scott Wyatt

Using HID devices with REALbasic
Date: 02.08.05 16:23 (Tue, 02 Aug 2005 16:23:09 +0100)
From: Dave Addey
Hi all,

Has anyone ever put together classes, or a plugin, etc., to make it easier
to support HID devices within REALbasic? I need more support than the
GameInput classes provide, as I¹m trying to add HID support for the X-Keys
devcies (www.xkeys.com) to my app. I¹ve been unable to find anything via a
search on the web.

Dave.
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Re: Using HID devices with REALbasic
Date: 02.08.05 16:37 (Tue, 2 Aug 2005 09:37:27 -0600)
From: Joseph J. Strout
At 4:23 PM +0100 8/2/05, Dave Addey wrote:

>Has anyone ever put together classes, or a plugin, etc., to make it easier
>to support HID devices within REALbasic? I need more support than the
>GameInput classes provide, as I'm trying to add HID support for the X-Keys
>devcies (www.xkeys.com) to my app. I've been unable to find anything via a
>search on the web.

I think you'll probably want to make declares to HID.bundle, the same
one used by the GameInput classes. You can find documentation (and
even source code) by digging around on Apple's developer web site.

HTH,
- Joe

Re: Using HID devices with REALbasic
Date: 02.08.05 18:10 (Tue, 02 Aug 2005 18:10:26 +0100)
From: Dave Addey
Hi Joe,

Sounds good - thanks for the tip! I see that even Halo takes the
"HID.bundle" approach - I have a HID.bundle sat next to Halo.app on my Mac
:-)

OOI, do you know if this bundle gives me the required functions to post HID
actions as events to a queue, rather than having to poll the current values
of the HID device elements?

Also, is there a way (RB 5.5.5) to get a handle to the GameInputXxxx objects
so that I can extend them myself via declares, or would I be better starting
from scratch with declares to this bundle?

Thanks,

Dave.

> From: "Joseph J. Strout" <<email address removed>>
> Reply-To: REALbasic NUG <<email address removed>>
> Date: Tue, 2 Aug 2005 09:37:27 -0600
> To: REALbasic NUG <<email address removed>>
> Subject: Re: Using HID devices with REALbasic
>
> At 4:23 PM +0100 8/2/05, Dave Addey wrote:
>
>> Has anyone ever put together classes, or a plugin, etc., to make it easier
>> to support HID devices within REALbasic? I need more support than the
>> GameInput classes provide, as I'm trying to add HID support for the X-Keys
>> devcies (www.xkeys.com) to my app. I've been unable to find anything via a
>> search on the web.
>
> I think you'll probably want to make declares to HID.bundle, the same
> one used by the GameInput classes. You can find documentation (and
> even source code) by digging around on Apple's developer web site.
>
> HTH,
> - Joe
>
> --
> Joe Strout REAL Software, Inc.
>
> Vote for REALbasic (twice!) in the LinuxWorld Reader's Choice Awards:
> http://linux.sys-con.com/general/readerschoice.htm
> _______________________________________________
> Unsubscribe or switch delivery mode:
> <http://www.realsoftware.com/support/listmanager/>
> Search the archives of this list here:
> <http://support.realsoftware.com/listarchives/lists.html>

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Re: Using HID devices with REALbasic
Date: 02.08.05 19:13 (Tue, 02 Aug 2005 11:13:37 -0700)
From: Scott Wyatt
If you read the archives, the HID/USB issue has been discussed at
length. There are limits to using HID, especially writing out to the
device to trigger responses.

We've had several people looking at a "real" HID plug-in, but haven't
heard back from them...

HID is a standard with scientific and POS hardware. It's causing some
issues for developing in RB.

- Scott
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Re: Using HID devices with REALbasic
Date: 02.08.05 20:35 (Tue, 2 Aug 2005 13:35:56 -0600)
From: Joseph J. Strout
At 6:10 PM +0100 8/2/05, Dave Addey wrote:

>Sounds good - thanks for the tip! I see that even Halo takes the
>"HID.bundle" approach - I have a HID.bundle sat next to Halo.app on my Mac
>:-)

Yep, it's pretty common.

>OOI, do you know if this bundle gives me the required functions to post HID
>actions as events to a queue, rather than having to poll the current values
>of the HID device elements?

I believe it does, but it's been a while since I looked inside it.

>Also, is there a way (RB 5.5.5) to get a handle to the GameInputXxxx objects
>so that I can extend them myself via declares, or would I be better starting
>from scratch with declares to this bundle?

No, there aren't any handles provided, though I think you could get
at the same devices and elements using their names. But it might be
easier to start from scratch.

Best,
- Joe

Re: Using HID devices with REALbasic
Date: 03.08.05 00:08 (Wed, 03 Aug 2005 00:08:06 +0100)
From: Dave Addey
Hi Joe,

Thanks - think I've found all of the info now. One final question: What do
I declare against to get to the functions in HID.bundle? I.e. What goes
after the "Lib" keyword in my declares? At the moment, anything I try
results in my debug app just sitting at the "launching the target
application" stage, and doesn't launch.

All the best,

Dave.

> From: "Joseph J. Strout" <<email address removed>>
> Reply-To: REALbasic NUG <<email address removed>>
> Date: Tue, 2 Aug 2005 13:35:56 -0600
> To: REALbasic NUG <<email address removed>>
> Subject: Re: Using HID devices with REALbasic
>
> At 6:10 PM +0100 8/2/05, Dave Addey wrote:
>
>> Sounds good - thanks for the tip! I see that even Halo takes the
>> "HID.bundle" approach - I have a HID.bundle sat next to Halo.app on my Mac
>> :-)
>
> Yep, it's pretty common.
>
>> OOI, do you know if this bundle gives me the required functions to post HID
>> actions as events to a queue, rather than having to poll the current values
>> of the HID device elements?
>
> I believe it does, but it's been a while since I looked inside it.
>
>> Also, is there a way (RB 5.5.5) to get a handle to the GameInputXxxx objects
>> so that I can extend them myself via declares, or would I be better starting
>> from scratch with declares to this bundle?
>
> No, there aren't any handles provided, though I think you could get
> at the same devices and elements using their names. But it might be
> easier to start from scratch.
>
> Best,
> - Joe
>
> --
> Joe Strout REAL Software, Inc.
>
> Vote for REALbasic (twice!) in the LinuxWorld Reader's Choice Awards:
> http://linux.sys-con.com/general/readerschoice.htm
> _______________________________________________
> Unsubscribe or switch delivery mode:
> <http://www.realsoftware.com/support/listmanager/>
> Search the archives of this list here:
> <http://support.realsoftware.com/listarchives/lists.html>

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Re: Using HID devices with REALbasic
Date: 03.08.05 11:26 (Wed, 03 Aug 2005 11:26:16 +0100)
From: Dave Addey
Hi Joe,

Just to say, I got it working. I ended up copying the libHIDUtilities.dylib
(from within HID.bundle) into a new "Frameworks" folder within my built
application's bundle, and declaring against
"@executable_path/../Frameworks/libHIDUtilities.dylib". I'll keep you all
posted about how I get on with creating the HID wrapper classes.

This approach does cause a few problems with debug builds, as they don't
have this dylib when built. So I created an applescript to do the build and
copying for me. In case this is useful for anyone else working with dylibs,
here's the applescript I used:

tell application "REALbasic 5.5.5 Mac OS X"

set appName to buildMacCarbonName & ".app"
build

end tell

tell application "Finder"

delay 1

set AppFolder to "Owl:test code:HID:"
set pathToApp to AppFolder & appName & ":"
set pathToContents to pathToApp & "Contents:"
make new folder at pathToContents with properties {name:"Frameworks"}
copy file (AppFolder & "libHIDUtilities.dylib") to folder
(pathToContents & "Frameworks:")

end tell

tell application appName

activate

end tell

The applescript, a copy of libHIDUtilities.dylib, and the realbasic project
file all live in "Owl:test code:HID:". Rather than running a debug build in
RB, I run this AppleScript (it's saved as an application, and mapped to my
left side mouse button), which build the app, copies in the dylib, and then
runs the app. It's not a true debug app, but it works!

Dave.

> From: Dave Addey <<email address removed>>
> Reply-To: REALbasic NUG <<email address removed>>
> Date: Wed, 03 Aug 2005 00:08:06 +0100
> To: REALbasic NUG <<email address removed>>
> Subject: Re: Using HID devices with REALbasic
>
> Hi Joe,
>
> Thanks - think I've found all of the info now. One final question: What do
> I declare against to get to the functions in HID.bundle? I.e. What goes
> after the "Lib" keyword in my declares? At the moment, anything I try
> results in my debug app just sitting at the "launching the target
> application" stage, and doesn't launch.
>
> All the best,
>
> Dave.
>
>> From: "Joseph J. Strout" <<email address removed>>
>> Reply-To: REALbasic NUG <<email address removed>>
>> Date: Tue, 2 Aug 2005 13:35:56 -0600
>> To: REALbasic NUG <<email address removed>>
>> Subject: Re: Using HID devices with REALbasic
>>
>> At 6:10 PM +0100 8/2/05, Dave Addey wrote:
>>
>>> Sounds good - thanks for the tip! I see that even Halo takes the
>>> "HID.bundle" approach - I have a HID.bundle sat next to Halo.app on my Mac
>>> :-)
>>
>> Yep, it's pretty common.
>>
>>> OOI, do you know if this bundle gives me the required functions to post HID
>>> actions as events to a queue, rather than having to poll the current values
>>> of the HID device elements?
>>
>> I believe it does, but it's been a while since I looked inside it.
>>
>>> Also, is there a way (RB 5.5.5) to get a handle to the GameInputXxxx objects
>>> so that I can extend them myself via declares, or would I be better starting
>>> from scratch with declares to this bundle?
>>
>> No, there aren't any handles provided, though I think you could get
>> at the same devices and elements using their names. But it might be
>> easier to start from scratch.
>>
>> Best,
>> - Joe
>>
>> --
>> Joe Strout REAL Software, Inc.
>>
>> Vote for REALbasic (twice!) in the LinuxWorld Reader's Choice Awards:
>> http://linux.sys-con.com/general/readerschoice.htm
>> _______________________________________________
>> Unsubscribe or switch delivery mode:
>> <http://www.realsoftware.com/support/listmanager/>
>>
>> Search the archives of this list here:
>> <http://support.realsoftware.com/listarchives/lists.html>
> _______________________________________________
> Unsubscribe or switch delivery mode:
> <http://www.realsoftware.com/support/listmanager/>
> Search the archives of this list here:
> <http://support.realsoftware.com/listarchives/lists.html>

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Re: Using HID devices with REALbasic
Date: 03.08.05 14:32 (Wed, 03 Aug 2005 14:32:38 +0100)
From: Dave Addey
...and then I found a whole bunch of other posts on this list, showing how
to do this for both build and debugbuild:

#if DebugBuild
Const kHIDLib = "@executable_path/../../../libHIDUtilities.dylib"
#else
Const kHIDLib = "@executable_path/../Frameworks/libHIDUtilities.dylib"
#endif

The reason for the three "../" in the debug case is that the application
that gets run is actually stored at AppName.app/Contents/MacOS/AppName, and
so you have to go back up the folder the three folders to get to the foldert
that Appname.app is stored in.

This does mean that you can't make the library be a global constant, and you
have to state it via the code above everywhere you want to declare against
it. But it does mean you can have a copy of the dylib in the same folder as
your app, and it will be referenced by debug builds. You can then still put
the dylib inside your app's package when you come to build it proper.

Apologies if this is old news for everyone else - thought it would be useful
if I tied it all together here for future list searchers.

Dave.

> From: Dave Addey <<email address removed>>
> Reply-To: REALbasic NUG <<email address removed>>
> Date: Wed, 03 Aug 2005 11:26:16 +0100
> To: REALbasic NUG <<email address removed>>
> Subject: Re: Using HID devices with REALbasic
>
> Hi Joe,
>
> Just to say, I got it working. I ended up copying the libHIDUtilities.dylib
> (from within HID.bundle) into a new "Frameworks" folder within my built
> application's bundle, and declaring against
> "@executable_path/../Frameworks/libHIDUtilities.dylib". I'll keep you all
> posted about how I get on with creating the HID wrapper classes.
>
> This approach does cause a few problems with debug builds, as they don't
> have this dylib when built. So I created an applescript to do the build and
> copying for me. In case this is useful for anyone else working with dylibs,
> here's the applescript I used:
>
> tell application "REALbasic 5.5.5 Mac OS X"
>
> set appName to buildMacCarbonName & ".app"
> build
>
> end tell
>
> tell application "Finder"
>
> delay 1
>
> set AppFolder to "Owl:test code:HID:"
> set pathToApp to AppFolder & appName & ":"
> set pathToContents to pathToApp & "Contents:"
> make new folder at pathToContents with properties {name:"Frameworks"}
> copy file (AppFolder & "libHIDUtilities.dylib") to folder
> (pathToContents & "Frameworks:")
>
> end tell
>
> tell application appName
>
> activate
>
> end tell
>
> The applescript, a copy of libHIDUtilities.dylib, and the realbasic project
> file all live in "Owl:test code:HID:". Rather than running a debug build in
> RB, I run this AppleScript (it's saved as an application, and mapped to my
> left side mouse button), which build the app, copies in the dylib, and then
> runs the app. It's not a true debug app, but it works!
>
> Dave.
>
>> From: Dave Addey <<email address removed>>
>> Reply-To: REALbasic NUG <<email address removed>>
>> Date: Wed, 03 Aug 2005 00:08:06 +0100
>> To: REALbasic NUG <<email address removed>>
>> Subject: Re: Using HID devices with REALbasic
>>
>> Hi Joe,
>>
>> Thanks - think I've found all of the info now. One final question: What do
>> I declare against to get to the functions in HID.bundle? I.e. What goes
>> after the "Lib" keyword in my declares? At the moment, anything I try
>> results in my debug app just sitting at the "launching the target
>> application" stage, and doesn't launch.
>>
>> All the best,
>>
>> Dave.
>>
>>> From: "Joseph J. Strout" <<email address removed>>
>>> Reply-To: REALbasic NUG <<email address removed>>
>>> Date: Tue, 2 Aug 2005 13:35:56 -0600
>>> To: REALbasic NUG <<email address removed>>
>>> Subject: Re: Using HID devices with REALbasic
>>>
>>> At 6:10 PM +0100 8/2/05, Dave Addey wrote:
>>>
>>>> Sounds good - thanks for the tip! I see that even Halo takes the
>>>> "HID.bundle" approach - I have a HID.bundle sat next to Halo.app on my Mac
>>>> :-)
>>>
>>> Yep, it's pretty common.
>>>
>>>> OOI, do you know if this bundle gives me the required functions to post HID
>>>> actions as events to a queue, rather than having to poll the current values
>>>> of the HID device elements?
>>>
>>> I believe it does, but it's been a while since I looked inside it.
>>>
>>>> Also, is there a way (RB 5.5.5) to get a handle to the GameInputXxxx
>>>> objects
>>>> so that I can extend them myself via declares, or would I be better
>>>> starting
>>>> from scratch with declares to this bundle?
>>>
>>> No, there aren't any handles provided, though I think you could get
>>> at the same devices and elements using their names. But it might be
>>> easier to start from scratch.
>>>
>>> Best,
>>> - Joe
>>>
>>> --
>>> Joe Strout REAL Software, Inc.
>>>
>>> Vote for REALbasic (twice!) in the LinuxWorld Reader's Choice Awards:
>>> http://linux.sys-con.com/general/readerschoice.htm
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Unsubscribe or switch delivery mode:
>>> <http://www.realsoftware.com/support/listmanager/>
>>>
>>> Search the archives of this list here:
>>> <http://support.realsoftware.com/listarchives/lists.html>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Unsubscribe or switch delivery mode:
>> <http://www.realsoftware.com/support/listmanager/>
>>
>> Search the archives of this list here:
>> <http://support.realsoftware.com/listarchives/lists.html>
> _______________________________________________
> Unsubscribe or switch delivery mode:
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Re: Using HID devices with REALbasic
Date: 03.08.05 16:22 (Wed, 3 Aug 2005 11:22:30 -0400)
From: Charles Yeomans
I think you might want to keep HID.bundle as is. You can still declare
functions from it. In Rb2005, you should now be able to just declare
to @executable_path/../Frameworks/HID.bundle. If not, try changing the
suffix from .bundle to .framework.

You can also avoid the problems with debug builds by using soft
declares. They will allow you to simply move HID.bundle into the debug
app after it starts up.

Charles Yeomans

On Aug 3, 2005, at 6:26 AM, Dave Addey wrote:

> Hi Joe,
>
> Just to say, I got it working. I ended up copying the
> libHIDUtilities.dylib
> (from within HID.bundle) into a new "Frameworks" folder within my built
> application's bundle, and declaring against
> "@executable_path/../Frameworks/libHIDUtilities.dylib". I'll keep you
> all
> posted about how I get on with creating the HID wrapper classes.
>
> This approach does cause a few problems with debug builds, as they
> don't
> have this dylib when built. So I created an applescript to do the
> build and
> copying for me. In case this is useful for anyone else working with
> dylibs,
> here's the applescript I used:
>
> tell application "REALbasic 5.5.5 Mac OS X"
>
> set appName to buildMacCarbonName & ".app"
> build
>
> end tell
>
> tell application "Finder"
>
> delay 1
>
> set AppFolder to "Owl:test code:HID:"
> set pathToApp to AppFolder & appName & ":"
> set pathToContents to pathToApp & "Contents:"
> make new folder at pathToContents with properties
> {name:"Frameworks"}
> copy file (AppFolder & "libHIDUtilities.dylib") to folder
> (pathToContents & "Frameworks:")
>
> end tell
>
> tell application appName
>
> activate
>
> end tell
>
> The applescript, a copy of libHIDUtilities.dylib, and the realbasic
> project
> file all live in "Owl:test code:HID:". Rather than running a debug
> build in
> RB, I run this AppleScript (it's saved as an application, and mapped
> to my
> left side mouse button), which build the app, copies in the dylib, and
> then
> runs the app. It's not a true debug app, but it works!

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Re: Using HID devices with REALbasic
Date: 03.08.05 17:49 (Wed, 03 Aug 2005 17:49:29 +0100)
From: Dave Addey
Hi Charles,

Thanks! OOI, what's the difference between using HID.bundle and the dylib
it contains? What extra benefit do I get by including the entire bundle?
(I'm still on 5.5.5, y'see...)

Dave.

> From: Charles Yeomans <<email address removed>>
> Reply-To: REALbasic NUG <<email address removed>>
> Date: Wed, 3 Aug 2005 11:22:30 -0400
> To: REALbasic NUG <<email address removed>>
> Subject: Re: Using HID devices with REALbasic
>
> I think you might want to keep HID.bundle as is. You can still declare
> functions from it. In Rb2005, you should now be able to just declare
> to @executable_path/../Frameworks/HID.bundle. If not, try changing the
> suffix from .bundle to .framework.
>
> You can also avoid the problems with debug builds by using soft
> declares. They will allow you to simply move HID.bundle into the debug
> app after it starts up.
>
> Charles Yeomans
>
> On Aug 3, 2005, at 6:26 AM, Dave Addey wrote:
>
>> Hi Joe,
>>
>> Just to say, I got it working. I ended up copying the
>> libHIDUtilities.dylib
>> (from within HID.bundle) into a new "Frameworks" folder within my built
>> application's bundle, and declaring against
>> "@executable_path/../Frameworks/libHIDUtilities.dylib". I'll keep you
>> all
>> posted about how I get on with creating the HID wrapper classes.
>>
>> This approach does cause a few problems with debug builds, as they
>> don't
>> have this dylib when built. So I created an applescript to do the
>> build and
>> copying for me. In case this is useful for anyone else working with
>> dylibs,
>> here's the applescript I used:
>>
>> tell application "REALbasic 5.5.5 Mac OS X"
>>
>> set appName to buildMacCarbonName & ".app"
>> build
>>
>> end tell
>>
>> tell application "Finder"
>>
>> delay 1
>>
>> set AppFolder to "Owl:test code:HID:"
>> set pathToApp to AppFolder & appName & ":"
>> set pathToContents to pathToApp & "Contents:"
>> make new folder at pathToContents with properties
>> {name:"Frameworks"}
>> copy file (AppFolder & "libHIDUtilities.dylib") to folder
>> (pathToContents & "Frameworks:")
>>
>> end tell
>>
>> tell application appName
>>
>> activate
>>
>> end tell
>>
>> The applescript, a copy of libHIDUtilities.dylib, and the realbasic
>> project
>> file all live in "Owl:test code:HID:". Rather than running a debug
>> build in
>> RB, I run this AppleScript (it's saved as an application, and mapped
>> to my
>> left side mouse button), which build the app, copies in the dylib, and
>> then
>> runs the app. It's not a true debug app, but it works!
>
> _______________________________________________
> Unsubscribe or switch delivery mode:
> <http://www.realsoftware.com/support/listmanager/>
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Re: Using HID devices with REALbasic
Date: 03.08.05 18:00 (Wed, 3 Aug 2005 13:00:09 -0400)
From: Charles Yeomans
There probably is no difference if the .dylib file is the sole item in
the bundle. Should that change, you might be surprised.

Charles Yeomans

On Aug 3, 2005, at 12:49 PM, Dave Addey wrote:

> Hi Charles,
>
> Thanks! OOI, what's the difference between using HID.bundle and the
> dylib
> it contains? What extra benefit do I get by including the entire
> bundle?
> (I'm still on 5.5.5, y'see...)
>

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Re: Using HID devices with REALbasic
Date: 03.08.05 21:09 (Wed, 03 Aug 2005 13:09:40 -0700)
From: Scott Wyatt
Anything you do to get full bi-directional HID support would be
appreciated. Keep us all up-to-date. I would love to see "GameInput"
renamed somehow to a more generic "Input" class/control combination.

- Scott
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